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InläggPostat: mån 08-05-26 13:17 
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Ethanol production in Brazil is not causing deforestation in the Amazon region, says Peter Zuurbier, Associate Professor and Director the Latin America Office of Wageningen University, the world's leading center of expertise on tropical agriculture.

According to him, the notion often held by NGO's that sugarcane is displacing cattle and soybean production into the Amazon is inaccurate. “The real problem lies in illegal deforestation and lack of property rights, as around 50 percent of the Amazon region has disputed titles and this is an invitation for timber companies” he says.

In an interview with Ethanol Statistics, prof Zuurbier tries to explain a dynamic process between illegal activities in the Amazon rainforest and the expansion of agricultural lands towards that region. NGO’s often state that sugarcane production is displacing cattle and soybean production towards and into the Amazon, burning down the area to make it suitable for agriculture and pastures.

According to Zuurbier however, the process is slightly different. “Well organized groups and corporations with questionable land titles, but also official land owners began to chop down large acreages of forest to trade timber, both legally and illegally” he says. “Usually, after the empty strips of land were abandoned, cattle owners would move into these cheap lands. However, after 3 to 4 years of cattle breeding, the thin soil of the Amazon is completely useless without any form of fertilization and livestock owners usually move into the next abandoned area. Soybean farmers meanwhile replace the livestock in these areas, recognizing the opportunity to fertilize the area for soybean production.”


read more here http://www.sucre-ethique.org/Wageningen ... -Brazilian

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InläggPostat: mån 08-05-26 13:21 
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De skrupellösa parasiterna jobbar i lag mao.
Utan inverkan av sockerrörsindustrin.

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InläggPostat: mån 08-05-26 14:40 
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De skrupellösa parasiterna jobbar i lag mao.
Utan inverkan av sockerrörsindustrin.


What?

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InläggPostat: mån 08-05-26 15:18 
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Citat:
Ethanol production in Brazil is not causing deforestation in the Amazon region, says Peter Zuurbier, Associate Professor and Director the Latin America Office of Wageningen University, the world's leading center of expertise on tropical agriculture.

According to him, the notion often held by NGO's that sugarcane is displacing cattle and soybean production into the Amazon is inaccurate. “The real problem lies in illegal deforestation and lack of property rights, as around 50 percent of the Amazon region has disputed titles and this is an invitation for timber companies” he says.

In an interview with Ethanol Statistics, prof Zuurbier tries to explain a dynamic process between illegal activities in the Amazon rainforest and the expansion of agricultural lands towards that region. NGO’s often state that sugarcane production is displacing cattle and soybean production towards and into the Amazon, burning down the area to make it suitable for agriculture and pastures.

According to Zuurbier however, the process is slightly different. “Well organized groups and corporations with questionable land titles, but also official land owners began to chop down large acreages of forest to trade timber, both legally and illegally” he says. “Usually, after the empty strips of land were abandoned, cattle owners would move into these cheap lands. However, after 3 to 4 years of cattle breeding, the thin soil of the Amazon is completely useless without any form of fertilization and livestock owners usually move into the next abandoned area. Soybean farmers meanwhile replace the livestock in these areas, recognizing the opportunity to fertilize the area for soybean production.”


read more here http://www.sucre-ethique.org/Wageningen ... -Brazilian

--------------------------
Well...

I think that conclusion is disputed.

Last week, the Brazilian environmental minister, Ms. Marina Silva, resigned. She cited the lost battle for the Amazon rainforest as the reason.
Cattle ranches are responsible for 60% of Amazon deforestation, illegal logging itself only for a few percent according to mongabay.com.

Lack of property rights is for sure an important reason and that is also giving the cattle ranchers an advantage since it becomes 'easy' to get hold of Amazon land. And sugar cane is replacing cattle ranching in the centre-southeast regions. So there is indefinently a connection between the increase in sugar cane farming and the depletion of the rainforest in the Amazon. Even if other factors also are important.

http://news.mongabay.com/2008/0514-brazil.html

/track_snake


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InläggPostat: mån 08-05-26 15:45 
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I think that conclusion is disputed.


I think it is the other way around, prof Zuurbier (which means sour beer by the way) is of the opinion that matters are slightly more complecated than what you usualy like to present them.

/Aryan

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InläggPostat: mån 08-05-26 15:49 
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And sugar cane is replacing cattle ranching in the centre-southeast regions. So there is indefinently a connection between the increase in sugar cane farming and the depletion of the rainforest in the Amazon.


As the professor tried to explain: No, there isn't.


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InläggPostat: mån 08-05-26 15:56 
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And sugar cane is replacing cattle ranching in the centre-southeast regions. So there is indefinently a connection between the increase in sugar cane farming and the depletion of the rainforest in the Amazon.


As the professor tried to explain: No, there isn't.

-------------------------------
As I just said: This conclusion is disputed.

The cattle farmer gets well paid for selling his land to the sugar barons in central-southeast Brazil. This income can buy much land in the Amazon especially as the system of land titling is malfunctioning. That is exactly what the cattle rancher is doing, and we have the indirect effect of sugar cane on the depletion of the Amazon rainforest.

That is at least what a majority of international experts (like me) and NGO:s say.

/track_snake


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InläggPostat: mån 08-05-26 16:00 
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Citat:
I think that conclusion is disputed.


I think it is the other way around, prof Zuurbier (which means sour beer by the way) is of the opinion that matters are slightly more complecated than what you usualy like to present them.

/Aryan

-----------------
Yes. But they are not so complicated that I don't see the relationship clearly... And many more with me:

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/artic ... 75,00.html

/track_snake


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InläggPostat: mån 08-05-26 16:44 
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And sugar cane is replacing cattle ranching in the centre-southeast regions. So there is indefinently a connection between the increase in sugar cane farming and the depletion of the rainforest in the Amazon.


As the professor tried to explain: No, there isn't.

-------------------------------
As I just said: This conclusion is disputed.

The cattle farmer gets well paid for selling his land to the sugar barons in central-southeast Brazil. This income can buy much land in the Amazon especially as the system of land titling is malfunctioning. That is exactly what the cattle rancher is doing, and we have the indirect effect of sugar cane on the depletion of the Amazon rainforest.

That is at least what a majority of international experts (like me) and NGO:s say.

/track_snake


Ergo:do not buy (illegal) timber from Brazil and stay away from Brasilian meat and soy (the latter might need you to stay away from most European meat as well) you are safe.

/Aryan

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InläggPostat: mån 08-05-26 17:18 
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And sugar cane is replacing cattle ranching in the centre-southeast regions. So there is indefinently a connection between the increase in sugar cane farming and the depletion of the rainforest in the Amazon.


As the professor tried to explain: No, there isn't.

-------------------------------
As I just said: This conclusion is disputed.

The cattle farmer gets well paid for selling his land to the sugar barons in central-southeast Brazil. This income can buy much land in the Amazon especially as the system of land titling is malfunctioning. That is exactly what the cattle rancher is doing, and we have the indirect effect of sugar cane on the depletion of the Amazon rainforest.

That is at least what a majority of international experts (like me) and NGO:s say.

/track_snake


Ergo:do not buy (illegal) timber from Brazil and stay away from Brasilian meat and soy (the latter might need you to stay away from most European meat as well) you are safe.

/Aryan

-------------------
That is what I am preaching also...

It is always good to cut down on red meat consumption. Cattle and sheep are big methane producers, and it is better for your health to eat more vegetables if possible.

/track_snake


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InläggPostat: tis 08-05-27 07:48 
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And sugar cane is replacing cattle ranching in the centre-southeast regions. So there is indefinently a connection between the increase in sugar cane farming and the depletion of the rainforest in the Amazon.


As the professor tried to explain: No, there isn't.

-------------------------------
As I just said: This conclusion is disputed.



So is the fact that the Earth is a globe... :roll:


Citat:

That is at least what a majority of international experts (like me) and NGO:s say.



It is disputed that you are an expert.


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Yes. But they are not so complicated that I don't see the relationship clearly... And many more with me:

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/artic ... 75,00.html


Well, "many more with you" are wrong too, then.


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InläggPostat: tis 08-05-27 08:27 
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Yes. But they are not so complicated that I don't see the relationship clearly... And many more with me:

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/artic ... 75,00.html


Well, "many more with you" are wrong too, then.


:D :D :D

/track_snake


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InläggPostat: tis 08-05-27 10:51 
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Yes. But they are not so complicated that I don't see the relationship clearly... And many more with me:

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/artic ... 75,00.html


Well, "many more with you" are wrong too, then.


:D :D :D



Yes, the link you gave is laugable. But, I guess "many more with you" don't want to discover the facts, becasue then they'll look ignorant.


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InläggPostat: tis 08-05-27 12:00 
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Yes. But they are not so complicated that I don't see the relationship clearly... And many more with me:

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/artic ... 75,00.html


Well, "many more with you" are wrong too, then.


:D :D :D



Yes, the link you gave is laugable. But, I guess "many more with you" don't want to discover the facts, becasue then they'll look ignorant.

-----------------------------
TIME is one of the most respectable magazines in the world. It is probably only you and a few others who think the link is laughable...

The simple fact is that sugar cane plantations are expanding; not into the Amazon in any larger extent but into areas earlier used for cattle ranching and soybean farming. And cattle and soybeans are moving into the Amazon area.

You can always discuss who is the culprit; sugar cane, cattle or soybeans. But what I am saying is that there is a connection between expansion of sugar cane plantations and cattle and soybeans expanding into the Amazon.

/track_snake


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